Wednesday 2 April 2008

Too serene for sympathy

Again an older article, but one that isn't out-of-date.

After an astonishing attack on the family by the winner of the Booker prize and Kate’s suggestion that people don’t sympathise with her because she doesn’t look maternal enough, our correpsondent asks why some people find it so easy to dislike the McCanns

Margarette Driscoll

The novelist Anne Enright must have thought that all her dreams had come true last Tuesday night when Sir Howard Davies, chairman of the Booker prize judges, announced that she had won the prestigious literary award – and the £50,000 that comes with it.

Guests at London’s Guildhall were touched at how thrilled Enright was, being more used to seasoned nominees who took the prospect of the prize in their stride. But it wasn’t long before the gloss was taken off her sudden success.

Attention turned from her “exhilaratingly bleak” novel, The Gathering, to an equally bleak and somewhat mean-spirited piece she wrote earlier this month – when hardly anybody had heard of her – in the London Review of Books, about her ambivalence towards Kate and Gerry McCann. In the article, she talked of how disliking the McCanns had become “an international sport”.

“Distancing yourself from the McCanns is a recent but potent form of magic,” she wrote. “You might think the comments on the internet are filled with hatred, but hate pulls the object close; what I see instead is dislike – an uneasy, unsettled, relentlessly petty emotion.”

She went on, saying “we do not forgive them the stupid stuff, like wearing ribbons, or going jogging the next day, or holding hands on the way into mass”. She also criticised Gerry McCann for using language “more appropriate to a corporate executive than to a desperate father”.

Instantly, Enright found herself on all the front pages for all the wrong reasons. Newspapers frantically outbid one another for the rights to reprint her piece – all were flatly refused. “She’s horrified and doesn’t want to become known as ‘evil Anne’,” said a friend. But by then it was already too late. ENRIGHT had given literary and intellectual weight to the heartless abuse that has rained down on the McCanns on the internet ever since their daughter Madeleine disappeared from their Portuguese holiday apartment on May 3. Her piece would have struck a chord with all those who had felt a twinge of guilty agreement as they came across message boards criticising the couple for their composure, their supposed arrogance, and particularly Kate for her careful grooming and “endless supply of summer tops”.

In an interview with the Liver-pool Echo last week, Susan Healy, Kate McCann’s mother, told how her daughter had been berated in the street by strangers for being “out and about” when Madeleine went missing and how Kate felt persecuted for not looking like the ideal mother.
“If I weighed another two stone, had a bigger bosom and looked more maternal, people would be more sympathetic,” she had told her mother, who spoke loudly in her daughter’s defence.
“She feels she’s being attacked because she isn’t crying every time she is pictured,” said Healy. “She’s being targeted because she manages to put on a brave face. People say she has a stern look but inside she’s a wreck.”

The paradox for Kate McCann is that ever since the death of Diana, Princess of Wales, we have been branded a crybaby nation, and told that the stiff upper lip, that key part of the British character, has been destroyed. But in an age of “misery memoirs” and reality TV, if you do show stoicism and coolness in the face of trauma, you are despised for it.

Kate, 39, has never cried in public, which may be for a number of admirable reasons: that she was told not to show emotion by advisers as her daughter’s kidnapper might delight in her distress; that part of being a doctor entails being able to face traumatic situations without showing distress; or because she knows just how much a picture of her crying would be worth and is bloody-minded enough not to let anybody get it.

But if she thinks people don’t like her because she does not appear sufficiently maternal, she’s way off beam. This is the age of the yummy mummy and in those stakes McCann, who looks as though she could be Sienna Miller’s older sister, is queen. It is her coolness of her manner that repels, not her skinniness, nor her careful choice of jewellery.

Most people would dismiss as ludicrous some of the rumours that have surfaced in the Portuguese press in recent weeks. The McCanns have variously been accused of engaging in wife-swapping, of sedating their children so they would sleep while they were out, of having “the scent of death” found on Kate by cadaver dogs. But still some spiteful undercurrent relishes seeing their perfect world punctured.

“I suppose it shows the ugly side of human nature. We are intrigued by disaster and horror stories,” said the novelist Rose Tremain.

“There is an element of schadenfreude about it: there seems to come a point with nearly every type of ‘celebrity’ where something triggers a turnaround.

“People seem to be presuming that the McCanns’ lack of emotion points to their guilt. It seems absurd as, at first, the public admired their bravery in the face of such a horrifying situation. They may not cry in public, but you can read the agony on their faces.”

The film-maker Roger Graef, who recently took a group of experts to Portugal to investigate the case, believes that the mystery at the heart of the case – how did Madeleine vanish into thin air? – has exacerbated our reaction to the McCanns.

“What we all have trouble with is the uncertainty and the reality that this has been done by somebody we’ll probably never find,” he said.

“To judge the McCanns when they’ve had to endure months of that uncertainty is gratuitously cruel. They’re being used as an emotional dartboard.”

In an effort to prove their innocence, the McCanns have compiled a huge file rebutting every allegation against them, from the idea that Gerry McCann is not Madeleine’s natural father to the DNA evidence that seemed to suggest her body had been transported in the back of their hire car.

Last week it emerged that they have gone so far as to have their two-year-old twins, Sean and Amelie, drug-tested to show that they have never been given sedatives.

And all the while the days tick by: it is now almost six months since Madeleine disappeared. They must, by now, have resigned themselves to her being dead.

Yet for all they have suffered – think how appalling being interrogated by the police must have been – some of us still can’t sympathise.

The psychologist Linda Papa-dopoulos thinks Kate’s looks may play some part in this. “Looks play a huge role in our expectations of people. We can see it in things like fairy tales, where the ugly outsider meets a nasty end. Beauty is taken to mean goodness. We tend to believe attractive people in the witness box more than unattractive people.

“But on the flip side of this, it is much easier to hate attractive people. There is a need for people to believe that an attractive person is not completely perfect.

“A woman I spoke to last week was appalled that Kate McCann was able to choose which earrings to wear in the morning. She took it to mean that if she has the strength to put on earrings she is not distressed enough.”
So is there a right way to grieve? Would people like Kate McCann more if she collapsed in tears?
“People are very judgmental when you suffer a bereavement. As a widow myself, I know that people have very strong views on how you should or shouldn’t express emotion,” said the broadcaster and writer Esther Rantzen.

“Kate looks anguished to me. They look like people in the midst of a nightmare.”

Some think it is a class issue. The broadcaster and columnist Kelvin MacKenzie says that when he wrote in defence of the McCanns shortly after Madeleine disappeared he got his biggest mailbag ever “and hundreds of e-mails full of bile aimed not just at the McCanns but also at me”.
“I was told that I wouldn’t have said anything of the sort had the McCanns been an unmarried, unemployed black couple and that the whole furore about Maddy came down to class bias,” he said.

“Initially I didn’t believe this to be the case, but now I have to agree. The massive media and public interest stems from the fact that they are a professional, upwardly mobile, white family and this sort of thing shouldn’t happen to people like them.

“Rhys Jones’s parents [whose 11-year-old son was shot dead on Merseyside in August] displayed a combination of tears and raw emotion with a basic intellect that came through in their interviews. This raw emotion has been lacking with the McCanns.”

And so the doubts linger. “Guilt and denial are the emotions we smell off Gerry and Kate McCann, and they madden us,” noted Enright. A friend of the family said Gerry McCann “snorted in disgust” when the piece was read to him last week.

Perhaps the McCanns’ central problem is that they don’t seem real to us. Simon Hamp-ton, a lecturer in psychosocial studies at the University of East Anglia, said the McCann tragedy encapsulates modern reactions to the media and morality.

“There is no sympathy because it is like a movie,” he said. “We are examining their clothes, their expressions, their body language much more closely than we would if we knew them.

“We rarely look at the faces of our families and friends from a distance of four inches, but that is how close television brings us to the McCanns’ faces. The narrative needs a villain and in the absence of any other, Kate McCann is cast as the murderer. It sort of has to be a woman because that is a better story.”

For those of us on the outside, it can appear to be just a story. But for the McCanns the pain is very real and, in all probability, never ending.

Maybe we should all just stop obsessing about them. A letter in response to Enright’s piece in the London Review of Books most neatly summed up our ambivalent relationship with the couple: “I disliked Anne Enright almost as much as the McCanns after reading her article, almost as much as I dislike myself for disliking the McCanns, for disliking Anne Enright, you for publishing Anne Enright’s article, and me for reading it (I didn’t have to do that). Where will it all end?”

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/world/europe/article2702285.ece

343 comments:

«Oldest   ‹Older   201 – 343 of 343
Christabel said...

Rosie you sod,
Evening all, flying visit again sorry.

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Hiya Christabel

Remember what I said to you earlier, young lady . . .

Rosiepops said...

SeaWitch

I thought she was lurking to get 201 comment again!

Christabel tried to beat me but she failed. lol

Anonymous said...

Someone calling me!!!You are much too late I have already earned my place as the best LURKER and first page poster around!!! See this morning, none of you lot get out of your pits quick enough to post!!!!LOL Exception is of course Sassy who has an advantage.

Rosiepops said...

Too late helen and SeaWitch said put your bum away!

Christabel said...

OH here we go ok Sass.

Hail Sass, Hail Sass, Hail Sass.!

I've got a lovely tan after that lol !

Tinkerbell43 said...

Helen, final score 1-1.

Hi Rosie, Christabel & Seawitch :-)

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Sea-Witch

Only just seen your hello post, so hello back.

Glad you got the invitation thing sorted out!

Anonymous said...

Thought you had been quiet Rosie!!

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Christabel

You learn fast!

Anonymous said...

Tinks was it an away game for your team?

SeaWitch said...

Am I missing something? What's with the "LURKER" jokes??!

Helen isn't Lurker, IS SHE?

I fink I am being fick or sum'n... :-0

Rosiepops said...

Hi Tinks

No I timed that just right!

Christabel said...

Hi Tinks,
I see Sass is taking this Queen thing very seriously.
She threatened me Tinks, said she'd click her mouse and poof I will be gone lol !

Rosie am I bovvered ? Yes !

Tinkerbell43 said...

Helen, yes, we have the vital away goal!

Has hubby called yet ?

Anonymous said...

ARCHER

HA HA HA FAECES I MEANT, NATURALLY HEE HEE

rosiepops

FOR GOD'S SAKE JUST PRISED THOSE PANTS DOWN AND GOT HELEN TO CHANGE, NOW YOU SPOIL IT AND TELL HER TO 'reveal herself'.

again?? DON'T BE SILLY WOMAN....

;o)))

Anonymous said...

Tinks, that's good for your team then, an advantage certainly for the next leg. Hubby rang at half time, only a quick one, didn't want to miss anything!!

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Tinks and Rosie

I merely pointed out that I had Christabel's blogging future in my hands! It was just a suggestion that she would be forever doomed to post on Vile's if she put my nose out of joint!

Rosiepops said...

SeaWitch

Don't say that you haven't noticed that Helen goes very quiet and lurks around the turn on the page so she gets the 201 comment? I thought everyone knew this and tonight it transpires that Christabel lurks too! lol

Anonymous said...

OK what's going on? Why have all the posts been re-arranged?

SeaWitch said...

Rosie,

I feel cheated. You lot were so busy jostling to get the page-turn post that you did me out of it!

My post was the only legitimate one, you bunch of cheats.......!

Tinkerbell43 said...

See what you mean Chris, she's gone Clicker happy!




Sass, Chris told me to say that!

Rosiepops said...

Helen

Moi quiet?

of course I am.

Rosiepops said...

seaSnitcherydoodah

are you saying that I was not legitimately laughing?

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

So Christabel is giving Tinks a cyber chinese burn to say stuff and Rosie has gone shy and retiring. OK who are you all and what have you done with my bloggers?

Rosiepops said...

PMSL Christabel thought she would fly in here and nick 201.

Sorry Christabel, better luck next time!

Helen first doesn't count lol

SeaWitch said...

RosieCrackPot

I'd say more of an evil cackle.

hehe....

hahahahahah......

aaaaaaaaaahahahahaaaaaaah!!!!!!!

That style o'fing!

Anonymous said...

am I in the 'twiglet, zone...

...again???

Rosiepops said...

Sass

we have all be taken over by

this is really the Twighlight Clone lol

Christabel said...

Tinks, you trying to get me clickered off.

Rosie I don't lurk, I look and listen lol !

Sorry Helen, Jane and Seawitch Hi how are you sensible posters?

Rosiepops said...

Well SeaSnitcherydoodah I do not have a cat, bet you do though.

Anonymous said...

ha ha sensible? moi??

not guilty

SeaWitch said...

Sass,

They've all been cloned and the real bloggers are in pickle jars with electrodes attached to what is left of their brains.

I'm the only one left, and you can tell it's me because my brain was already pickled!

Christabel said...

Jane,

well I had to say summat lol.

Rosiepops said...

Christabel

You said you flew in did you get a lift on SeaSnitcherydoodah's broom stick?

Anonymous said...

gotta go now, wish I didn't, but can't stay.

have fun folks and see ou soon.

I will read all your posts tomorrow morning to see what on earth you got up to.....

;o)))

sleep well all, take care.

SeaWitch said...

RosiePoodle,

If you don't watch out, I'm going to turn your "Little Dog" into a little frog.

That'll learnya!

Tinkerbell43 said...

Nite Jane, I know exactly what you mean, its approaching that time where I argue with myself whether to me sensible or reckless!

Take care xx

Christabel said...

Rosie,

flu, no I came on me bike lol!

Rosiepops said...

Jane

I hope you can get back into the Twiglet Clone when you get back.

Anonymous said...

Hi, just had a look on TWS Ana and Claudia have arrived to keep TW company. Will be interesting to see if the psychotic anon appears. What I have noticed is that Athena is not posting there, sensible woman. Not seen 2345 for some time either.

Rosiepops said...

It is 3rd April tomorrow

Anonymous said...

Night Jane and Tinks, Sleep well.

Rosiepops said...

Helen

2345 was around yesterday in all her foooooorensic glory!

Christabel said...

Helen,

2345 is having a rest before the fooorrreeennnsssiiiiccccs are announced lol.

1357 has taken over the dogs statements for now.

Tinkerbell43 said...

Helen,

I've not gone yet, I'm still arguing with myself, lol.

Christabel said...

Nite and Bless Tinks and Jane xx

Rosiepops said...

I thought you came on SeaWitch's brrrrrrrrooooom stick with her cat!

SeaWitch said...

Psychlone,

Keep your hands off Jane; you're not taking her as well!


Night, Janey, I won't be far behind you.

Oh, and Hi, sass and Tinks, didn't mean to ignore you saying hello....!

Christabel said...

Seawitch,

so you meant to ignore me then ?
oh well never mind aye lol.

Rosiepops said...

SeaWitch

Are you calling me a psychoclone?

or are you referring to Christaclone?

Night Jane be careful of seaWitch she has put a spell on us.

SeaWitch said...

Christabel,

yes, I was - because you had the nerve to call me a sensible poster!

I resent that remark! LOL!

Rosiepops said...

Tinkaclone why are you arguing with yourself?
Have you been taking lessons from Felvivity?

Christabel said...

I'm going now then cos Seawitch has hurt my feelings boo hoo.

Anonymous said...

Rosie, we know it's the third mane, what's the significance?

Saw this post from Isis I m sure she will not mind me pinching it, made me smile


isis said...
Zodiac, there used to be only 2 sure things in life..death and taxes.. i think we can now add athird to that........ The pj will come to the uk !!

Wednesday, 2 April 2008 22:23:00 o'clock BST

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Nighty night Jane!

Tinks - you off too? If so night!

Rosiepops said...

Helen where are you?

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Thanks for the explanations as to what happened to my bloggers! That explains a lot!

SeaWitch said...

Psychlone,

Yes, I was referring to you!

I wouldn't dare insult Christaclone 'cos she's got crystal balls and that ain't playing fair!

Rosiepops said...

excuse me for PMSL, the only sure things in life are death, taxes and that the PJ will come to the UK?

Is she serious? I am rotflmao here.

it is the 3rd april, the significance is that it will be 4 days to go the 7th!

Mum21 said...

Sorry I have been away so long...but I have been studying something. That photograph on viv's blog yesterday...the one with the children in the pushchair..
The reason it shows Gerry laughing is because the photo has been doctored. A diffent head and face has been superimposed on Gerry's body. Whoever did it was not that hot on graphic work because they have a distinct line showing on his neck.
How much lower can these people stoop?

Anonymous said...

Well reading between the lines on TWS Claudia has seen movements within the PJ (now now girls don't be crude!!) and is more interested in those who aren't than those that are!!! Going to England that is!!!

Anonymous said...

Thought as much Mum, but you know TW staed that she had received it from a friend!!!

Rosiepops said...

Sea Itch

is feeling a bit scratchy

SeaWitch said...

isis said...
Zodiac, there used to be only 2 sure things in life..death and taxes.. i think we can now add athird to that........ The pj will come to the uk !!


Cor, ver' fillersoffical, dat.

Rosiepops said...

Claudia has seen movements in the PJ?

what their backs as they were running away from her?

Mum21 said...

Helen...perhaps she did receive it from a friend. All I do know is somebody...be it TW or a friend...it has been changed.
I very much doubt the TW actually has any friends....if she does they are witches.

Rosiepops said...

seems to me they just cannot accept what is happening here and are desperately flaying around clutching at straws! (or her drawers - after she has seen movements in the PJ)

Mum21 said...

Rosie, Are the PJ capable of running? I very much doubt it.

Tinkerbell43 said...

Mum21,

Well observed and thanks. Nothing surprises me with that lot. They were even ridiculing Kate yesterday for playing with the childs hair. Of course, she couldn't possibly be waving a fly or something away from the childs head. No, thats too normal. They make me sick!

Mum21 said...

That Ana amuses me. Sometimes she writes perfect English...other times she fumbles with her words.
She is just a total waste of space.

SeaWitch said...

No, Rosie,

SeaTwitch is feeling nervous.

"Cor, Dear" is scaring me with her visions!

Anonymous said...

Right, well if the PJ are going to England our village will be in need of neighbourhood watch!!! Better get an early night then.

Goodnight ladies, sleep well.

SeaWitch said...

Night, Helen,

sleep well x

dianeh said...

HI To you all

Another mad morning this morning. The kids are here, as Nana had to go to have some tests. Little girl is sick today and couldnt go to Pre school, was in bed with me from 3 am, so I havent had the best sleep.

Little boy is running around but being fairly well behaved. He is getting his hair cut this morning, his dad is taking him, so it will be all screams and cries at the hairdressers. He hates it and of course it takes ten times longer because he wont sit still.

Good to see that we have given the troublemakers the flick. I do agree that they will get bored and we will be able to open up the blog again after a while.

chinadoll said...

So, Paulo Pereira Cristovao, who was a pj officer in the case of missing Joana Cipriani, was later made an arguido by the Portuguese system and was suspected of perverting the course of justice in the matter of this missing child. A child, incidentally, that went missing seven miles away from Praira de Luz.

Despite the above, Christovoa, published and handsomely profited from a book titled 'The star of Joana'

Christavao attended court as an arguido in the matter and was subsequently charged in connection with the brutalising/assault of the missing girls mother, Leanor Cipriani.

Christavoa, was a fully functioning member of the pj, until September 07 - the same month that Kate and Gerry were made arguidos into the disappearance of their beloved daughter.

Despite not being cited as an investigative officer in the Madeleine McCann case, he has written and published a book called the 'Star of Madeleine'

The sources and information he based the contents of the book on, remain secret - yet, it is expected to be another best seller.

Upon leaving the pj in September 07 Christavoa, became the head of the Association for Missing Children.

According to the daily telegraph...............


Mr Pereira Cristovao, 38, left the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) in September and now heads the Portuguese Association for Missing Children (APCD), which leads the hunt for missing children in Portugal.

When Madeleine disappeared on May 3 from the hotel apartment in Praia da Luz she became the ninth official missing child in the country but Mr Pereira Cristovao said her case would not be considered by the organisation.

"I was asked what I thought about inviting the McCanns to the APCD. I said no, because they're suspects," said Mr Pereira Cristovao.

"She is (the ninth child on the PJ's missing people page) but the case involves a criminal investigation which is still on the boil, with the parents as suspects." "We have eight children whose disappearances are unexplained," he said vowing not to rest until he had discovered what happened to them.

Commenting on the snub, Mr Mitchell said: ""Madeleine is still a missing child and she went missing in Portugal so we would hope that she would be treated as such by this organisation but ultimately that is a matter for them."


please see link

Anonymous said...

Mum do you not think that she is Alsabella? I have noticed she flits from pidgeon English to very good. Just some of her posts remind me very much of Alsabella's like one tonight when she is telling Claudia that the Mccann's will be unable to see the PJ's files on them unless they are charged. Failing that she says it will be August.

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Mum21

That photo is well sick in that case! You think some people can't sink any further then they amaze you and show you how wrong you are!

As far as Ana is concerned, I don't think she is Alsabella - I don't think she is even Portuguese. I have seen an Ana commenting on the McCanns on a few occasions (not dx) and it's always written that she's from Stockholm.

Rosiepops said...

Mum

I think thay are all sick. I honestly do not understand how any sane and rational person can be a regular contributor to TWS blog!

Tinkerbell43 said...

Nite all, sleep well and take care xxx

Mum21 said...

Helen and Sass,
I am not sure about Ana. She may be Alsa but somehow I don't think so. I did try to translate something Alsa said to Claudia a couple of nights ago in Portuguese. (When she made that brief visit to TW's blog). It was not a good translation...but it seemed to be about a sister and a daughter. It seemed to be to do with why Alsa froze her blog. But they were certainly talking about a daughter and sister.

Mum21 said...

Rosie, Docmac is boasting again. He says there is a way to overcome this blog being by invitation only...but he went on to say it was time consuming and he could not be bothered.
He also said the news he had was mostly for us...but as he can no longer view our reponse...he will not bother to post it. te he he

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Tinks Night!

Mum21 Do you have any idea where that Portuguese stuff is?

chinadoll said...

Oh and in addition, Rosiepops informed us last night, that Christavoa is also heavily involved in a Portuguese tabloid newspaper that is well reknowned for leaking details of the case, from unnamed official pj sources.

It Stinks and big time.

Rosiepops said...

I think ana is Alsabella, it is just too coincidental.

Ana turned up the night before A's blog went off and she also started by speaking in Portuguese then broken English and then all of a sudden could write in Perfect English.
I may be wrong but I would bet a grand on this being Alsabella.

Mum21 said...

Sass...it was only a couple of days ago...late at night when Alsa appeared.

dianeh said...

Mum/Tink

What is wrong with playing with your child's hair? (I know it isnt you, it is the 'others').

We joke in my family about the hair twirling gene. My daughter and I both have it. When we are tired, we twirl hair, either our own or someone else's. If we are both tired and laying together, such as like this morning in bed, we twirl each other's hair.

I always play with my kids hair and with my nephews and nieces hair and they must love it because they keep coming back for more.

It just never ceases to amaze me how pathetic they are on the other blog.

Rosiepops said...

Mum

On retrospect no the PJ do not run, this is why they are always late back from lunch!

SeaWitch said...

Night, Tinks.

Has Christabel gone, too?

chinadoll said...

Well,

Perhaps if I were to join in the slagging off of the other blog, someone might notice I am here.

Goodnight.

Mum21 said...

Sass..It was under the 30th.March. Kate's Story. Near the end of the posts when Alsa and Claudia were having a conversation in Portuguese. In the end Viv asked them to post in English

dianeh said...

China

How did you get the link into your post? Spill the beans, save me having to look it up.

I havent had a chance to read your posts,as am a bit busy trying to work and look after kids but will get back to look later on.

SeaWitch said...

China,

I have noticed you're here. I have just read your post and the Telegraph link.

I am appalled that this man continues to hold such an important office and he describes the other 8 missing children as "unexplained".

This seems to imply that the case of Madeleine McCann is "explained".

Since the PJ do not yet claim to have detected the case, and the child is still missing, that is a dnagerous assumption to make.

It would be interesting to know what his organisation actually does and what it's remit is.

Will have a look.

Mum21 said...

This is the best translation I could get. Claudia was talking to Alsa.

Ó pours of the isóbelita, in a you excandalizes, daughter. To genti I knew iscreberi. Ixto is alone pair I disguised! Dix there to your sister ka genti likes bué of her and k to keri of bolta well rápidú! Kisses! !!!

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

I'm off

Night!

Ta Mum21 - will check it out tomorrow!

Mum21 said...

Here it is in Portuguese.

ó mana da isóbelita, num te excandalizes, filha. A genti sabi iscreberi. Ixto é só pa disfarçari! Dix lá à tua mana ka genti gosta bué dela e k a keri de bolta bem rápidú!
Beijocas!!!!

The Candy Floss blog really sucks said...

Chinadoll

Don't get the hump - it happens to all of us! It has happened to me that when a couple of people are very into yakking, I could do a strip and not be noticed!

It's been a helluva day with the other blog. Nasty clones and nasty comments to go with it. Everyone is just enjoying the relaxed atmosphere now!

Night, China

Rosiepops said...

china

i was just going to the other story to read your link, did not get time to do ths today as this place went nuts again.
It got so bad that no one knew who anyone really was.

I have been trying to help Mandz and her computer for ages and still no luck.

I said goodnight the other night to you lot the other night and you were all so busy having a laugh that no one notice me going!

I dont think I got on repy!

Anonymous said...

Mum, I have my Portuguese lesson mane will have her translate it. She is a linguist so will know what language it is in.

If Ana is Alsabella then Claudia has just given her real name out on TWS.

Rosiepops said...

Mum

what is that it must be in some regional dialect as it doesn't really translate well.

Rosiepops said...

helen

I always assumed that Alsabella was an ID or a diminutive for a similar name.

I would be interested in knowing what was said, obviously they know if they speak in a regional dialect or something it will not translate properly.

The slyness of that convinces me even more that this is Alsabella, she is so devious.

Mum21 said...

I know it does not translate well. I have tried several translation programs and they all say something different. One says daughter...another one son.
So I think I will leave it to Helen to get it translated by her tutor.

chinadoll said...

Sassy,

If you had taken the time to read last nights posts and my anger at this character Christavoa, then you would realise, that your last post to me, was way off the radar.

Rosiepops - The link of mine that you mentioned/picked up on, is not on last nights article, but tonights. I would, however, appreciate it, if, as and when you do get the time to do so, you look back on last night - then you may understand the email.

Anonymous said...

If you look at the posts between 22.48 and 22.51 between Claudia and Ana you will see Claudia's slip.

Mum filha is definitely daughter, if it was a boy it would be filho. I suppose it could be Brazilian Portuguese.

SeaWitch said...

Night Sass,

I'm gonna turn in now, too. Nice speaking to you all.

Goodnight, everyone!

Mum21 said...

Alsabella is on Vile's blog now.

Mum21 said...

Good Night Seawitch
and God Bless.

good Night All...I am off now too.
See you all tomorrow.

dianeh said...

China

Have just cut and paste the relevant section from the telegraph article you have referenced

___________________________________

Mr Pereira Cristovao, 38, left the Policia Judiciaria (PJ) in September and now heads the Portuguese Association for Missing Children (APCD), which leads the hunt for missing children in Portugal.

When Madeleine disappeared on May 3 from the hotel apartment in Praia da Luz she became the ninth official missing child in the country but Mr Pereira Cristovao said her case would not be considered by the organisation.

"I was asked what I thought about inviting the McCanns to the APCD. I said no, because they're suspects," said Mr Pereira Cristovao.

"She is (the ninth child on the PJ's missing people page) but the case involves a criminal investigation which is still on the boil, with the parents as suspects." "We have eight children whose disappearances are unexplained," he said vowing not to rest until he had discovered what happened to them.

Commenting on the snub, Mr Mitchell said: ""Madeleine is still a missing child and she went missing in Portugal so we would hope that she would be treated as such by this organisation but ultimately that is a matter for them."
----------------------------------

You know it does confirm (in a condensed fashion) that he was appointed to be head of the new missing childrens organisation after he was charged in the Leonor Cipriano case. How bizarre is that?

And silly me, I thought that the arguido status was to protect the McCanns, and doesnt imply they are guilty. Yet here we have a portugese former copper saying that because they are suspects the missing daughter isnt going to be classed as missing by his organisation.

How bizarre is that?

Rosie has been highlighting this and other discrepancies for quite a while and China and myself have just realised this one (took us a while to cotton on, sorry Rosie). This alone should be one of the things the British press pursues in their hunt for the truth of this. Maybe we should send an email to Martin Brunt or the one that writes those excellent articles in the times on line.

dianeh said...

Just trying to outdo China for the longest post. Need to practice a bit more.

chinadoll said...

Just a reminder..........

chinadoll said...
Sassy,

If you had taken the time to read last nights posts and my anger at this character Christavoa, then you would realise, that your last post to me, was way off the radar.

Rosiepops - The link of mine that you mentioned/picked up on, is not on last nights article, but tonights. I would, however, appreciate it, if, as and when you do get the time to do so, you look back on last night - then you may understand the email.

02 April 2008 23:49

Anonymous said...

Really going now. Sleep well all.

Chinadoll if you are looking in so sorry about tonight. No excuses.
Do hope you will return mane.

Rosiepops said...

China and Diane

This is one of the articles that I took a real hammering for on the DX. Like China did yesterday i got really angry and called this man an odious Portuguese ex PJ journalist pimp making money on the back of an innocent missing child and the Portuguese posters went wild and aided and abetted by the others they all hit their report buttons and I picked up a second ban.

I just find this whole thing incredulous that he was made head of this unit while under suspicion himself. How could that possibly be allowed to happen?

As China said yesterday regardless of her parents status, Madeleine is a missing child and she went missing in Portugal and why is it down to this one man who is included in this list?

I find the whole thing very perturbing, personally I think it opens a massive can of worms and is worth reporting to the UK PM's office to try and get them to act, because I keep saying this, something is very very wrong in PDL/Portugal.

China I had read this before, in fact I think it is appropriate to take excerpts from it for a front page story, in the lead up to the PJ *supposedly* coming to the UK on the 7th. It highlights many things that some people do not even know.

I had hoped that we would carry on today where we left off yesterday, but that idiot clone disrupted the whole blog. Still thanks to Sass they will not be allowed to do so again!

chinadoll said...

Wow, thanks for that Rosiepops,

The thing is, I do not have a good memory for names, but have supected certain things for a while now. I do not like to out and out condone, but last night, I reached the point, via my own steam that this Christovao character, is a bad one. A rotten apple imdo

(In my definite opinion)

Rosiepops said...

China and Diane

Just read SeaWitch post and this has brought up another worm out of the can! We were wondering where this man got the info he needed to write his odious book?
Well being the head of a unit like this I would think the PJ give him inside information all the time to help in their enquiries?

Is it possible that he may have used some of this information to write both books?

can you honestly see something like this happening in this country while a case was still active?

What is happening there? the more I learn, the more I fear!

Sometimes I someone there knows exactly where Madeleine is!

chinadoll said...

Exactly Rosie,

Exactly.

Diane picked up on it too.

Rosiepops said...

China

What really bugs me greatly is that all this is happening and all this is actually known and it appears all these antis can easily ignore the truth and only concentrate on complete and utter fabrication.

All this was happening with this author, yet not one of them at that time thought to mention that he was also the author of "The Star of Joana", the must have known this yet kept very quiet about it, why was that I wonder?

Were they secretly ashamed of this man writing these books so said nothing?

They should be but somehow I do not think they are, I think this story has been dehumanised by most of them and is not about Madeleine anymore, but is about winning and it disgusts me.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

Are you there?

dianeh said...

China/Rosie

The whole thing is disgusting.

And I have just visited Vile's blog, as I had a thought about something (doesnt happen often so went to check it out) but while I was there I noticed that Paulo Reis, complaining (third hand I think, not sure as they cant seem to reference their posts properly) that someone from Leic Police has given confidential info to one of the Tapas 7, concerning what the questions are to be.

Now in my opinion, this is probably just rubbish, as the Leic police wouldnt jeoparise their reputation but a single lone copper might just do it. However, before accusing, there needs to be proof. The Leic police should go for this man, Paulo Reis I mean.

But when the PJ has been leaking like a sieve and waging a blatant propaganda war, using absolute lies to ruin the reputation of the McCanns, and Paulo Reis said nothing, how dare he then intimate that the British police are doing something illegal. He is morally bankrupt that man. Does he not see how hypocritical he is?

chinadoll said...

It damn well disgusts me too.

Last night, I felt, as if the last piece of the jigsaw has dropped in and I feel saddened for Portugal - a once great country that will, in future be associated with the name Christovao

Madeleine -v- Christovao

In the name of God, what is this mans agenda???????????/

dianeh said...

Rosie/China

On Christavoa (??), in this country he would not be allowed receive any proceeds from a book which is as a result of criminal activity. In other words, if you perform a crime, you cannot write about it and profit by it.

So here, because he is under charges, all proceeds would be frozen. If he is found guilty, the proceeds from the book would most likely go to the victim or some fund for victims of crime.

Not noticed that this is happening regarding the Star of Joanna.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

You are right - it is absolute and utter rubbish.

How low can they stoop?

They have no case, so they start leaking again - - - - but only to blogs, so far. Even the Daily mirror has not printed that one!

dianeh said...

China

I think this man's agenda is to make money. He has a reputation to uphold and without it no one would buy his books.

So this upcoming court case, if he is found guilty will see him removed from the Missing Childrens Foundation, getting a prison sentence and hopefully sued for libel, and have all the proceeds of both books taken from him.

Now that would be justice, wouldnt it. Not helping Madeleine or Joanna but justice still.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

Yes, tragically, that is the case.

The more contacts in the pj, the better

The more books the merrier

Justice Portuguese style

dianeh said...

China

They should print it. But they should do it to show the world just how many lies are being put out there and taken up as truth. If Paulo Reis has proof that there has been a leak of info by Leic police then he should have went there first. In UK, as in Aust there are processes in place to deal with such things, and he would have been listened to. I suspect he has nothing, or he would have went via the correct channels.

Despicable man.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

It surely would be justice.

In addition, the parents of Madeleine and Joana, could sue - at least theoretically - just to make a point.

He is small fry, but he is one of many worms imo

chinadoll said...

Indeed Diane, he has nothing.

Anyone devoid of recognition, has nothing - hence, the need to trawl the blogs - sicko

Would a real journalist, of such standing - or a real doctor of such standing, really be here?

Only asking,

I am a real astronaut lol

dianeh said...

China

to me it doesnt matter how many of them there are, if you get one, then it hurts them all.

AND, if he thought he was going to lose everything, depending upon the type of person he is, he might turn in others, to save himself.

I know that it is said there are no deals in Portugal but you know, that is just crap. Deals happen everywhere, particularly if you are giving information on other guilty people.

I am now very interested in what happens in the Cipriano case.

Rosiepops said...

I have a name and an email address for Leicestershire police perhaps I will write to it tomorrow and inform them what Paulo Reis has said?

good idea?

Maybe I will forward the leak to the Leic police?

Bloody PJ are total hypocrites if you ask me, they have been leaking like a sieve and this is alright as long as they are blackening the name of someone else else and blaming their alleged incompetence on someone else it is OK!

I suppose it is still too much to ask that the antis see how hypocritical they are all being?

chinadoll said...

Rosiepops,

Send me the email address too, I, also have some information and comments to provide.

dianeh said...

Rosie

Good idea, I think you should.

On the vile blog, there is the full article but I dont know if there is a link to the original blog. I also presume the original to be in Portugese. But hey, the Leic police should be able to sort all of that out.

Rosiepops said...

Oh and I am a nuclear physicist and i know all about "A Brief Moment Of Time" and I can explain it.

Rosiepops said...

his site is generally written in English.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

Another excellent observation.

I am tuned into this too.

Perhaps the upper echelons of Portuguese government will step in. Afterall, it seems that whenever anything dodgy needs the silent treatment, this is the norm

They have picked on the wrong family this time imdo

dianeh said...

And I still think we should go to Martin Brunt or someone else with the Christovao info, and ask them to research further and do a story on it.

If I though I could get one of our papers or tv channels interested I would send to them. But although I know some of the female presenters are following the case closely, it is doubtful the editors or producers would get involved in it. The whole thing would be fraught with libel but it is possible to do it just asking lots of questions, allowing people to draw their own conclusions. That is how many investigative pieces are done and although some end up in court, most of them dont.

chinadoll said...

Diane,

I have been feeling somewhat bereft since the penny dropped.

What have the likes of Christovao and his chums, been putting this poor family through ??

chinadoll said...

Goodnight all,

Christovao and Co.,

What a tangled web we weave, when we paractice to deceive.

Rosiepops said...

I cannot find that entry on Reis's blog, but I see that Helenm has so i will get the link from her and them send the email off to the Leic police, I am sure they will be very interested to read that they maybe being libelled by a Portuguese two bit journalist!

Anyway I am off to bed now, very tired again and loads to d tomorrow.

We must pick this up again and run with it.

I read many things that really annoyed me on that site and this man was supposed to be a respected journalist ex Times?



Good night sleep well China and take care good day Diane have a nice one. xxx

xxx God Bless Madeleine xxx

dianeh said...

China

Take care

Have faith that all will be well in this. At least for the Kate & Gerry. The truth will prevail in the end, and those that have harmed innocents will be made to suffer themselves.

It is for Madeleine that I despair. Where is she? Will she be found soon, or at all? I continue to pray she will be found and returned to her parents.

May God protect you Madeleine, wherever you may be.

Rosiepops said...

Diane

So do I think we should go to someone to try and get them to expose this.

Just what the hell is going on there and more to the point what could be being covered up?

Paulo Christavoa you are a disgrace to your country and what little respect I had for the Portuguese judicial system has now dissipated.

Portuguese Tour st Industry? Shove it!

But there is more to this than the Portuguese tourist industry in my opinion, something really sinister could be being covered up!

How could this man Christavoa, be allowed to profit from the sales of a book about a trial he is now facing charges over? It is not right and it certainly is not decent.

dianeh said...

Back again

I just had a thought, that makes two for the day.

In regards to the list of 25 witnesses that the McCanns legal team has supplied to the PJ. These witnesses are said to have been there at the resort on the night that Madeleine disappeared, yet none of the 25 listed have been interviewed.

There are various anti's going ballistic about how dare arguidos tell the PJ how to conduct the investigation. But realistically, if these witnesses were not interviewed and have not since been interviewed, then if any charges were ever brought against either the McCanns or Murat, the lack of formal interviews of these people will be able to be used to generate reasonable doubt. I am assuming that in Portugal they have the same presumption of innocence and that the accused must be found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

Surely if the PJ wanted to form a case and make it stick, they need to take out all reasonable doubt. And to do that, they must interview these witnesses. Each of these 25 witnesses could potentially end up in court on the side of the defence. What sort of prosecution doesnt cover this sort of thing off?

It makes me think there will never be any charges laid. It would be waste of time, if it is going to be so easy to raise reasonable doubt. There never was a case unless they could get a confession. And as the McCanns didnt have anything to confess, then ?????. That is the only possible reason why these witnesses werent interviewed. Because these witnesses are irrelevant if there is a confession. The whole thing (leaks, smears etc) has been waged for a confession, nothing else makes any sense.

Just needed to share it with you. When I first read about the 25 witnesses it didnt make any sense. But I read about them again today, and now it has finally fallen into place.

No case, without a confession, as no evidence. Therefore all 25 witnesses are irrelevant to PJ case, as not needed if get a confession for a prosecution. And as without a confession, no prosecution can take place, therefore 25 witnesses not needed.


Simple when put like that. If the PJ had evidence, then it would be imperative the 25 witnesses cannot be used in court to defeat the case, so must be interviewed. I wonder why none of those anti's dont seem to realise this.

dianeh said...

And on the witnesses.

And what if one of the 25 not interviewed has the vital piece of evidence needed to help find Madeleine.

Truly astounding, isnt it?

"Leave no stone unturned"

calcite51 said...

I finally got on - took me a long time to get on - not sure if the system was down but am finally here.

Read all your comments. I would definitely get a hold of Google and complain about how easy it is to clone another blogger. I'm surprised Google even allows this to happen.

Don't the PJ's ever learn? What is wrong with them? Tubby was the first one to make the comment about the Leichestershire police being too sympathetic to the McCanns and looked what happened to him? Now, this ediot is accusing the Leicester police of leaking questions to the witnesses?? What is going on??

dianeh said...

Hi Calcite

Good to see you made it on.

I must admit that a few things have started to fall into place with me in the last few days. I have had my doubts about the PJ but now I am really beginning to doubt that they have done a proper job at all.

Like the 25 witnesses. I knew about them from Dec but I just read about them again in a more recent article. And after a bit of thought (yes it did hurt), I now see this as support for our theory that the PJ have no evidence and never did, and were relying a confession they were never going to get.

And then is this Christavao (??) character. How did he get his information from the book? How could an accused in a criminal investigation involving the assault of the mother of a missing child be offered the position of the head of a missing person foundation. Why if he is charged with assaulting Joanna's mother is he allowed to profit from a book about Joanna.

And so on, and so on.

Now I know that I always say that asking a load of questions is just a conspiracy, not evidence. But I am not suggesting a conspiracy, nor do I even have a theory. I just want these things to be answered, and by officials in Portugal. And answered in a public forum so that the people of Portugal can see it for themselves.

All of this is an aside to finding Madeleine.

Cheers

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